Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by Maggie on 5/6/2002, 10:16 am , in reply to "Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    All the recent movies that have been named in the other posts are excellent examples of why a film does not always need big names, but Hollywood history is full of examples of “little films” with “no name" actors that became huge hits. One of my favorites is Marty. It was a low-budget film starring a then unknown actor named Ernest Borgnine. It became a phenomenal success and won four Oscars, including Best Actor, Best Director and Best Picture. Certain lines and scenes from that movie became part of the popular culture for years afterward.

    Mary Poppins can also be included since Warner Bros. rejected Julie Andrews for My Fair Lady on the grounds that Jack Warner didn’t think the American movie audience would pay to see an “unknown English actress.” Warner had to eat his words when Walt Disney cast her as Mary Poppins that same year, the film was a smash, and Julie won the Oscar for Best Actress.

    There are so many instances of big stars turning out big flops that you would think the studios had learned a lesson by now. But no, they still are fixated on the “star” thing. What they often fail to understand is that the main component of a successful movie is a good story. Both the original Star Wars and Raiders of the Lost Ark had casts made of up of mostly little known actors, but they had such rousing good stories that no one cared. A solidly entertaining story will get great word of mouth and keep drawing in customers. Often a star actually is “born” out of such a movie. However, all the big stars in the world can’t save a weak story or a crummy script. Just ask anyone connected with Heaven’s Gate. That was the all-time classic star-packed flop. It laid a chicken coop full of eggs!

    The Phantom of the Opera has so much going for it that it would be insane to tamper with any of its elements. All it needs for movie success is a straightforward adaptation that would preserve the story and the score AND the performance of its original star. When you have an actor who has given the definitive performance of a character, won every award for it he possibly could, and has become ingrained in the minds of people all over the world through the sales of 20+ million cast albums, you have your star. A “name” actor would have to climb the thespian equivalent of Mt. Everest to avoid comparison with Michael Crawford and would still come off looking second best. Andrew Lloyd Webber doesn’t seem to want to admit the obvious…his POTO was a very good show; Michael Crawford made it a legend.

     

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by melinda on 5/6/2002, 9:06 am , in reply to "Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    "So, what makes a film successful and appealing to movie audiences?"

    First, a well written script. No amount of special effects, visual ambience, the musical score, costuming or star names can overcome a poorly written script. 'Gone with the Wind' wasn't successful because of the burning warehouse scene effects, the beauty of Tara and Seven Oaks, musical score, authentic costuming or Clark Gable and Vivien Leigh (an unknown in the US at the time). It was successful due to the exquisite conversion of a beautifully written novel to a beautifully written screenplay. How many times have we heard in school – Content is more important than the nifty folder that holds it. Seems some studio executives spent too much time on the wrong side of the classroom door. No matter what Webber believes, POTO cannot be built on the back of his musical score alone. Music compliments the storyline not the other way around.

    How much of it truly rests on the draw of a Hollywood name?

    I don't believe that the 'draw of a Hollywood name' even exists in this era of film. No so called 'name star' today can pack a theater on name alone. Well known stars whose PR staff are working overtime promoting every detail of a celebrities life are actually lessening their clients ability to acquire roles. They become so intimately known to the audience that they lose their credibility and ability to become some one else - the character they are to portray. As Jane pointed out they become a distraction rather than an asset.

    As far as POTO, Michael Crawford is the 'name star' just as Robert Preston was the 'name star' for 'The Music Man'. His characterization is the one most associated with the role of the phantom. His unique voice, accent, and enunciation are etched in the brains of millions of fans who have been wearing out the OCRCD waiting for this film. For millions of POTO fans Crawford's highly recognizable and unique voice is the only characterization of the phantom they have ever heard and they have heard this distinct voice for ten+ years. Every time MC sings any song from POTO, he reinforces the sound of the voice of the phantom and tightens the connection between actor and the role. All others actors, no matter how well they sing or act will be compared to Crawford's voice. Critics who reviewed the revival of 'The Music Man' made it a point to state (usually in the first sentence of their review) that the actor playing the role of Harold Hill was not Robert Preston. A PR nightmare for POTO would be to have the critics write the same sentence. "The actor (fill in any name) playing the role of the Phantom is not Michael Crawford.

     

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by Jane fairlee on 5/6/2002, 2:32 am , in reply to "Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    A movie like POTO not only doesn't need a big name actor, a big name actor will actually detract from it. POTO succeeds or fails on its ability to draw the audience into the story. If the audience is distracted thinking about WHO is under the mask and regretting that some cute actor has his face covered up or is busy thinking I didn't know he could sing they're not into the movie. Alfred Hitchcock said one reason to cast a star is because it saves you 20 minutes establishing his character. Cast a star whose persona matches the character and the audience brings with it their impressions of the actor and their previous roles. In a lot of cases this works. In something like POTO it doesn't.

    Movies that no one knows what they are about may benefit from having a star or a name that gives the audience a clue what to expect. Movies that have name recognition and a ready made fan base such as Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings and POTO not only don't need "big names"; casting "big names" is more likely to turn that fan base off than do anything else. The minute the studios start talking about how they need some "Name" they are sending the fans the message that they don't have enough faith in their product and that their main interest is NOT in making the best movie possible. Studios underestimate their audiences. A great movie makes the stars the stars don't make the movie. Titanic made Leo and Kate big not vice versa. Leo's next movie went right down the tubes. It's not the star that makes the hit; it's the coming together of the right actor in the right role. It's often a case of the whole being greater than the sum of its parts. Casablanca with Ronald Reagan would have been a different movie than Casablanca with Humphrey Bogart. The remake of Psycho didn't hold a candle to the original. Lucy instead of Angela in Mame was a disaster.

    Good word of mouth and enthusiastic fan support will do more to make a movie a hit than any "big name" can possibly do.

     

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by Jake on 5/5/2002, 7:24 pm , in reply to "Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    Well, let's see . . . three of the biggest successes of the past year (and actually ever), Spider Man, Harry Potter, and Lord of the Rings, have starred, for the most part, relatively unknown actors. What has made these films popular? There are three things, I believe, each interconnected with the others:

    1. Because the actors that were picked were extremely well-chosen and were perfect for their roles. The filmmakers put their qualifications above their popularity and won big time.

    2. The stories of these movies each already had very heavily established and large fan bases. Therefore, the films already had a market and all they had to do was please the fans to instantly guarantee millions of dollars in ticket receipts. Pleasing the fan bases of such extraordinarily popular creations such as Harry Potter, Marvel Comics, Tolkien's novels, and, indeed, The Phantom of the Opera, will instantly guarantee an enormous critical and financial success.

    3. These were each very close to the original works upon which they were based. Each was already successful in its own original form. If each of their original books were successful, then there must be a winning formula there. So, to make a film, why not just lightly adapt the already hugely successful formula which has been time-tested and proven to the big screen, where, along with the most competent cast and team, you can please the enormous fan base and proceed to have a successful film beyond your wildest dreams? It seems like a winning ticket to me.

    Jake

     

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by Tiffany on 5/5/2002, 2:51 pm , in reply to "Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    Of course not!

    A prime example? Star Wars: A New Hope!

    Harrison Ford, Carrie Fisher, and Mark Hamill were practically unknowns back then. And look now...Star Wars has become a cultural ICON, much less a successful film. And Harrison Ford was launched to stardom and continues to be a Hollywood A-list actor to this day.

    So, it stands to reason that since Michael Crawford already has all that recognition from the stage version of the show, then he should be phenomenal in the movie version!

    Need I really say more?

    Tiffany

     

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by joyce on 5/5/2002, 4:17 pm , in reply to "Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    I agree with Tiffany: It does not have to be a Big name star, to do a bang up picture. A lot of the stars have been unknown, until a studio did the right thing and gave them their Big Break, Gene Kelly took that chance with Michael, in "Hello Dolly, and Michael did a great job there, although Walter Matthau, and Barbara Streisand, were in it. Both of them were unknowns also, until there big break.
    So it does not have to be a Big Name Star, to bring in the Movie Fans. Lord of the Rings, Harry Potter, are just a few New Movies, whose stars are unknowns. So it does not take a Big Name to do the job, Just the original character, to make the movie creditable. joyce

     

 

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by Crysania on 5/5/2002, 6:01 pm , in reply to "Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    The Star Trek series all fall right into that as well. Look at the original series. All unknowns, as far as I know, and look at the following the entire thing has! It has to do with quality, not with "names." Everyone wasn't big at some point and had to prove themselves SOMEHOW!

    ~Crysania

     

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by Rachel on 5/6/2002, 11:28 am , in reply to "Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    All excellent points made for this argument- I agree with everything said by Maggie, Melinda, Jane, Jake, Tiffany, and Crysania. We all know the POTO film certainly does not need any big-name Hollywood stars to make it a success, but it does need Michael Crawford's portrayal of the Phantom for sure!

    Rachel

     

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by Crysania on 5/6/2002, 1:11 pm , in reply to "Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    Bingo! *L* That right there is the key...Michael Crawford! Could you imagine how the Star Trek: TNG movies would have done in the box office if they had gotten all big names to play them, rather than the fantastic actors who made the roles famous? Sure, not everyone knows the names of the people who PLAYED the characters, but it was the CHARACTERS that people loved, BECAUSE of how they were portrayed. Putting someone else in a role would have destroyed it. Just as putting someone ELSE in the role of the Phantom would destroy the movie version of the musical.

    ~Crysania

     

    Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?

    Posted by melinda on 5/6/2002, 2:02 pm , in reply to "Re: Q & A # 7 - Do films require big named actors to be a box office success?"

     

    "Sure, not everyone knows the names of the people who PLAYED the characters…"

    But we sure know their faces, voices, mannerisms, common phrases used by each character. accents, etc. This show has been playing on one station or another for decades. I never saw the original shows but have seen them on cable - so I know Spock, Scotty, Bones, Kirk, Sulu, Chekov and the whole gang. They are Leonard Nimoy, James Doohan, DeForrest Kelly, William Shatner, George Takei and Walter Koenig and not Pitt, Clooney, Cosner or any other 'name'. actors. While I'm not a big Star Trek fan, I wouldn't want anyone else to play these roles. Thank goodness someone respected the fans enough to cast the original stars. I'm still ticked about Jon Voight playing Mr. Phelps in the 'Mission Impossible' movie and having him made the bad guy. They could have come up with a different character name and it would have worked just as well. At least they didn't cast Peter Graves or someone who looked like him and had him play Phelps as the villain. Hm… I think I'll watch my 'Mission Impossible' video tapes tonight. Do da do … do da do … dum, da, da, dum…